Transcript
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Now let's introduce our guest, but I'm not going to introduce him.
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Our new co-host, Mike, is going to introduce him. Mike, I think that just makes
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the most sense. What do you think?
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I mean, why not? Let's do it. Yeah. On this show, I just bring things on people.
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So as you should know that by now, right, Mike?
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Yeah. It's great at putting people on the spot, right? Oh, hell yes.
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Hell yes. Just watch out, Dan. Sorry to do that to you. Why'd you say his name?
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You didn't introduce him yet.
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Well, so I'm excited to introduce our new special guest. to the Uncle Dad Talks.
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And he's a friend of mine. He's also a five-time Eisner nominee.
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Whoa. My good friend, Dan Brereton. Hey, guys. Thanks for hanging on.
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I've been doing a lot of these chats and podcasts lately, and they've been a lot of fun.
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So I'm really looking forward to the next six hours on the podcast with you guys.
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All right. Well, we definitely don't have six hours, but we'll trick that down to an hour.
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I really was kidding when I said six hours. Oh, okay. No worries.
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But what I do plan on doing, me and Mike just found this out the other day,
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is that I want to do a break the world record for the longest podcast in one episode.
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So I will have you on when we do that. Oh, okay.
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It'll be like the telethon? Yeah, it'll be a straight nonstop telethon.
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Exactly, yeah. Podcast-a-thon?
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Podcast-a-thon, exactly, yeah. The record is almost 72 hours.
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So we're going to break it by doing 73. Hey, why not go for 80?
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Go for, you know, end day work week.
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What's funny is, could you imagine if we did that? That would just be insane.
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And Mike is already hesitant about doing the 72 hours.
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Yeah, this is, again, something that he sprung on me right here on the show. I had no idea.
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That's excessive. That's three days, right? Right. So three days plus an extra
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hour of just incoherent babbling in the 73rd hour.
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You're drooling. Oh, yeah. Yeah. But hey, if you make it that far,
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that's all that matters. All right. I don't want to tell you the meth addict. Yeah.
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I don't know how it's going to go.
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All right guys dan thank you
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so much for being on the show i really appreciate it i've always heard nothing
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but great things about you obviously i know your work uh nocturnals is one of
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the greatest i think one of the greatest comic book series to be made i i have
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to tell you i i doubt you remember this and that's totally fine you and i actually
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did meet one time a long long time ago which was actually funny because it was
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the first day i met mike in my whole entire life,
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yeah it was a convention in sacramento and at that convention before i met you i actually met
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mike for the very first time and you were you were great you signed
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my i actually still have it it's an art i have to go find it
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but it's a lithograph that you did for the nocturnals and you
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had like so many left and it was one of my favorite pieces i have so thank
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you okay so it must be long how long ago is
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that that must have been a while ago oh yeah i know i've known mike since i
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was 16 i'm not 31 so oh my goodness basically yeah that's like 2000 or something
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well i don't know about that but yeah mike i'm not so good i think it was about
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2006 2006 is probably when this happened. Yeah, yeah.
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That sounds right. Yeah, which does sound about right, yeah.
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So, Mike, I'll let you kick it off with the experience here.
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Go ahead. We really just kind of want to get to know you.
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One of the things about Separate, Socialize that we like to give people stories
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on a very, like, deep level, as much as you're willing to express, of course.
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Yeah, so I want to have Mike start it off. You can ask the first question,
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then I'll kind of hop in here and there. But thank you again, Dan. Mike, go ahead.
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Yeah. So basically, Dan, we thought October would be a great month to have you on being that,
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you know, so much of your artwork is kind of centered around like Halloween
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and the colors of fall and kind of a very October-ish feeling very specifically
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with nocturnals, which is, you know, your own creation.
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But let me just say really quick, I was
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14 when I was first coming across dan's
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art so this was probably you know 45 years
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ago and that's about
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right yeah yeah i was i was collecting
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marvel trading cards and it was the marvel masterpieces in 93 and the ultra
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x-men fleer cards in 94 that you had done some artwork on and i was at a friend
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of mine's was a friend that we both have, Steve,
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and I was looking at the cards with his son, David,
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and David goes, yeah, my dad knows that guy. And I go, oh, no way.
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The thought that I knew someone who knew someone that did that when I was 14
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was just really exciting. Wow.
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I don't have bragging rights to a lot of things and I'm not the braggy type guy, but,
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Betzman trading card set. When they came to me to do card illustrations for
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it, they said, you can do as many as you can get done in a month.
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I think it was the month of October or November or something like that.
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And I did a total of 15 cards for the set. I beat out the person who had the
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second most cards was Bilson Kevitt.
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So I beat him out by one card to have the most cards in that set.
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So that was pretty cool. And I don't think I can say that about much of anything
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else that was a collaborative type of thing.
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But that was a lot of fun. And that introduced me to the world of here are,
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you know, 45 cards for you to sign, please.
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Oh, not even please. Just put them down in front of me and then have me sign
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them in a comic shop and then have people in line saying, is your hand getting tired?
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Yeah, that never gets old. A
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group of fans. Then the ones that come up and that are courteous and warm.
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These guys are just like, I can't wait to flip these, I guess. I don't know.
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But it was still fun. I still get people coming up to me and mentioning those and stuff like that.
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That's pretty cool. I actually wasn't aware that you did those cards.
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I mean, when those came out, I was only like, what, six?
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Yeah, I think my – did that come out – did those come out in 92 or 94?
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94? I think 94. So they came out around the same time Hunter was born.
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Or I was doing them at the same time Hunter was born, around there.
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Wow. yeah and hunter's 26 now or almost
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27 yeah oh wow yeah well it's
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amazing so then if you can can you
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tell us where mike may already know this but can you tell us where it all starts
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like where the art journey of yours starts i can go back pretty far when it
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comes to that i really feel like you know as far as what mike was also mentioning
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about halloween and october and fall and all that kind of stuff.
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It starts very early for me because I remember, I have memories of my first
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Halloween where I was almost two.
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So I was a month shy of two years old. And I know some people will say,
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oh, I remember what it was like to be in the crib.
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It's not so much that. I think it's the trauma of the night is what stuck with me forever.
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And what I do, I've been told a lot of things about that night.
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But what I do remember is encountering three witches with a cauldron that was steaming.
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And these witches terrified me with their hag faces and their voices and saying
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they were going to put me in the pot and cook me and all this other stuff.
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You know, being very terrified and scared and crying.
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And then realizing that these were my aunts and my grandmother disguised for
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Halloween under these masks.
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And the cauldron was full of dry ice and it was Halloween and we were in their driveway.
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I still remember that. People will say, Like my parents sometimes have said,
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or, or my aunt will say, how can you remember that? You were too young.
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I said, well, I remember things about your house. I remember that you guys had
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a seahorse water fountain that spit water into your pool and.
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My mom goes, she didn't have one of those. And Carol goes, yeah, actually we did.
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My Aunt Carol. So I think the reason I remember that and a couple of other key
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events from when I was around that age is because they stick with you and they're
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traumatic. Not necessarily in a terrifying way that scarred me for life.
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Although I was afraid of the dark and all those kinds of things happened during
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my childhood. But then my kids, you know. But Halloween was always special to me.
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And even though I was really scared the first time, I think I picked up what it was all about. out.
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And the fact that I like to draw monsters from before I was in kindergarten,
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because monsters were easy to draw. No one could tell you were drawing a monster wrong.
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You didn't have that feeling of like, I don't know how to draw monsters.
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You could just draw a monster. You know, I mean, when it came to drawing other things, it's tougher.
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And so I used to draw monsters a lot. What was your favorite monster to draw real quick?
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When I was a kid, I used to draw like sort of these sort of lizardy,
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dinosaur looking things and dragons that was kind of the big
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thing i wasn't really into supernatural stuff i mean i wasn't
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into vampires or frankenstein or dracula none of
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that stuff introduced i mean and even godzilla i wasn't that interested in godzilla
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because you know it just seemed like a guy in a suit and they're kind of silly
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and stuff but i liked ultra man a lot yeah man was fighting monsters and he
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was cool and he you know but but i didn't really get into to supernatural stuff
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until I was older, until I was in teens.
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Started reading Stephen King and getting into the work of Bernie Wrightson.
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Oh yes, Bernie Wrightson. And things like that. And then that,
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and you know, kind of out of getting out of science fiction and fantasy,
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and going more into horror.
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By the time Clyde Barker was a huge deal, I was just starting comics.
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So I was reading Clyde Barker. And I think Clyde Barker was the last of the
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big horror years for me until I started getting into crime fiction for a long time.
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So I was really into crime fiction. And now I read everything.
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You know, horror, fantasy, westerns, crime, sci-fi, historical novels,
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you know, just whatever, you know, autobiographies.
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I like to soak up whatever fascinates me, whatever is interesting to me at the time.
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And I'll soak it up for a while and then I make everyone in the house around
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me crazy for six months while I can't stop talking about the Beatles or,
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you know, or Julius Caesar or whatever it is. Right, right.
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But I don't, I tend not to talk about the horror stuff for obvious reasons because
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I don't want to, you know, mess anyone's head up.
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Sure. But I love this time of year. I love fall. I love Halloween.
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I love all the stuff that goes with it.
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I'm sort of old school when it comes to Halloween. I mean, to me,
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Halloween isn't Jason and Freddy.
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Do you know what I mean? It's scarecrows and pumpkin jack-o'-lanterns and witches
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and ghosts and things like that.
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It's trick-or-treating and, like Mike said, orange, fall colors, orange and black.
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And the nocturnals is, that's all in the nocturnals as well,
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except the nocturnals just isn't a Halloween comic.
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It's kind of a distillation of the things that I hold dear.
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And when I started doing the comic, it was definitely, let's do something that
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feels like crime fiction, but is horror and is Raymond Chandler and Dashiell Hammett and H.P.
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Lovecraft and Halloween and Hanna-Barbera and just, you know,
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like a sort of distillation of all these things that I loved and putting it
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together in a way that made sense.
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And at the time there were people who said, well, you're crossing all these
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genres together. It doesn't seem like it should work.
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And I'm like, well, it works for me. And, um,
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I, you know, there weren't a lot of, um, sort of crimes slash horror hybrid,
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uh, things going on in comics at the time. And there weren't a lot of little
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girl characters either.
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That stuff started to come more in the nineties and the early two thousands,
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um, got more and more of that stuff.
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And, uh, you get more, you know, younger people with their different, um, uh.
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Backgrounds and, and influences coming into comics.
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And, and, you know, now look, look, look where it's gone
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it's it's directly influencing television and
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film and streaming shows and things like that so i can ridiculously
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heavy degree which is good you know
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which is good absolutely i do want to kind
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of jump in there real quick and um you mentioned uh bernie
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wrightson and for those who don't know uh bernie wrightson is
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probably one he's most famous for at least in my
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opinion he created a swamp thing right remember
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correctly right yeah and how many right when we yeah
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yeah yeah just so we can make sure we we credit
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those and then uh clive barker for those who don't know clive barker is
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a legendary horror author up there with stephen king
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and he's also done video games movies and whatnot pretty much
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everybody knows clive barker for hellraiser i would say yeah he
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uh he directed i guess the first two yeah
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first two hellraiser films he also is an he's a
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very accomplished and prolific artist he paints
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like yes yeah a lot um i
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actually have his a piece for he did for fangoria uh for
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the special edition he did there's a i have to go get it but it's
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a very special piece he did like this beautiful like horrifying mask and it
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was the cover and i actually have that post yeah it's a yeah he's a nice guy
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too i i i did a signing with him because i back in in the early 90s i i did
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a comic graphic novel adaptation of one of his short stories called Dread from the Books of Blood.
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And Dread was my favorite story, and I was lucky enough to get to do that.
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It was a little bit of an arduous task because the adaptation was so literal,
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and there was so much of the prose that was in the story.
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And it's a story where not a lot of stuff happens in the beginning.
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A lot of it's in the heads of the characters and stuff like that.
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But it was really great to be able to flex and work on something like that and
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try and expand my skill set, I guess, working on that.
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Although I did turn down a Wolverine
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Punisher graphic novel that Marvel offered me at the time. Oh, wow.
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Which they called License to Print Money and probably would have been.
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But in the Clive Barker thing, I don't think I saw a dime from past my page rate.
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But I did get to meet Clive. We did do a signing together. He's a very charming guy, very charismatic.
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Very talented and unfortunately no one knows where those films are to be able
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to put that book back in print because I'd like to see it back in print someday
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right right if you can find Dread if you can find it track it down it's.
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It's fun it's a fun Clyde Barker horror sort of thing and it's probably the most straight up,
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horror that you'll see me have done because the
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stuff i do is more spooky than than disturbing
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you know um the way that clive's work is i
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would have loved to have done more stuff like that i just you tend to get um
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you tend to get uh kind of compartmentalized by people they want to put you
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in a box and and this guy's good at this stuff and they don't and they're comfortable
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having you there so you don't so you don't always get to expand so that when later on i mean I mean,
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I don't know, 10 or 12 years later,
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I was offered a chance to do historical fiction with Disney Italia on the last
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battle, which is Romans and Celts in the time of Julius Caesar.
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That I kind of, I almost turned it down. I tried to turn it down three times
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because I just didn't think I was right for it.
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But then when I realized that I could invest myself in this story like I I couldn't
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any other through the characters.
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And then I kind of immersed myself in kind of a crash course in just sort of
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learning about that era. Because we don't cover that in school.
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Maybe they do a little bit now. But I immersed myself in 52 BC and what was
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going on there in Europe and the Roman Empire and the Celts and stuff like that.
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And that actually led to a great appreciation and love of history,
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especially ancient history.
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History but but i but the point is is that i was able to expand again because the thing that really,
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pushed me to do that book was well you
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know look what look what look at frank miller did frank
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miller did you know 300 and no
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one would have ever expected that from him if he can do 300 maybe this will
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be my 300 now it didn't turn out to be my 300 i mean it didn't go on to be a
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movie it didn't sell millions of copies it did fine in Italy and it did okay
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over here actually but it was kind of a one-off and that was fine I'm gonna
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be right back go ahead and continue I'm gonna be right back go ahead yeah so but.
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We were talking about why did i we're talking oh yeah we're talking about clive
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barker and uh and and and we were talking about bernie wrightson earlier too
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and that was the job well yeah i mean you yeah i guess like being kind of being
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pigeonholed into doing a certain type of.
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Genre right but you do so much i mean you've done obviously your nocturnal and
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the last battle like you were mentioning, but I mean, you've done Punisher, you've done Batman,
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JLA, you did Iron Fist, and then you just did an X-Men story that's coming out soon too, right?
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Yeah, I have, you know, I've done not a ton of things for Marvel over the last
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30 something years, but I've done quite a few things.
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I've done some Thor stuff. The X-Men story came about last year when I was just
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finishing the campaign for my Giant Killer 20th anniversary hardcover was finishing up.
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And I was prepared to work on that book, putting that book together and doing
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new material for it and all this kind of stuff.
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And then I got a call from Alex Ross and he told me he was curating this anthology,
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this Marvel anthology, getting artists who he he liked and who he knew together
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to do short pieces, short stories for this anthology.
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And he said, you can do whatever you want. You can pick any characters from
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the Marvel universe, 10 pages.
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You can write it. You can work with the writer, whatever you want to do.
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And then it was just up to me to kind of figure out, can I make this fit into my schedule?
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Do I want to turn this down? No, I don't want to turn this down,
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especially since I was going to ask Alex to do a pin-up for my Giant Killer book.
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Couldn't very well say no and then ask him for a pin-up.
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As it turned out, he did a wonderful pin-up and I said yes. And I took a lot
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of time to do the X-Men story, a lot more than I thought I would, actually.
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I thought I would work on it over maybe two months during the summer to do 10 pages.
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And it took me all the summer and into the fall.
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And I'm glad I did it. I saw some of the pages when you were working on it,
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and I think it's some of your best stuff. I mean, it's amazing.
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Like, it's really fun. I appreciate hearing that, because I'm not sure how I
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feel about it, to be honest.
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I feel like I was looking way too much at Alex's stuff while I was doing it.
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I was looking at Dave Cochran's stuff a lot because I went back to that era.
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The story I did takes place the day after the events of Giant Size X-Men number one in 1975. Oh, wow.
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The style of Cochran, Cochran style, and even just the coloring and all that
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kind of stuff that was going on in that book really informed what I did.
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And I also didn't want to veer away from that too much with some of my crazy painterly stuff.
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So I just tried to do the best job that I could. it and also
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looking at the way that alex was so such a master when
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it comes to the superhouse stuff i mean pretty much everything he tackles
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yeah it's always usually just amazing that is the
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worst thing an artist can do is just stare at alex ross's stuff
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while you're working do not do that that isn't bad yeah because i spent all
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summer feeling inadequate basically and feeling like i was trying to fill this
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person's shoes and no one told me to do that no that was not That was on me. I put that on myself.
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Can I say this real quickly? I generally mean this a hundred percent.
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We said this on the show in the past.
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I actually think your art is better than Alex Ross.
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I truly mean that. Well, I'm sorry for you.
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Look, Alex Ross's work is great. It's amazing. I'm not saying it's not.
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I have some great pieces of his, but...
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There is just something about the way you, I don't know, it's just, I don't know, it's like.
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Well, it's a feeling that you can get when you look at yours.
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I mean, sure, you can look at Alex Ross's stuff and it looks like a picture
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was taken with incredible Photoshop work to make the shine really shine and whatnot.
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And yet he doesn't use Photoshop. He's a total Luddite. And that's the thing.
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And his mastery of technique is journeyman level.
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I mean, there's nobody who can, there's very few people who can match or beat
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him when it comes to the technical aspect of how he's able to achieve effects.
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Mostly with just water-based medium, acrylic and watercolor, so successfully.
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And with this feeling of complete
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mastery of the surface and mastery of
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the technique and i feel like when i'm painting and
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i started painting i i kind of know where i'm gonna i know what
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i can do i understand technique and things like that but there's
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still this kind of like anything can happen feeling when i started painting
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and i like i said i have an idea of what i'm doing what i'm going to do but
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i don't have it down to like some minute compartmentalized detailed effort that
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i know ahead of time is going to happen i I just kind of go and do what I'm doing enough.
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And it's funny because Alex and I used to say, he used to say,
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I wish I could get looser like you.
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And I'd say, well, I wish I could get tighter like you. So I think that one
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of the main things is Alex has this goal in mind, this job that he's doing,
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which is to not only knock your socks off,
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but to conform reality to his imagination.
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Nation so if he can imagine a thing he can make it
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look real for you and present it to you in a way that you'll believe it you
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know when you you know and look at any of the stuff you're talking about
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look at the look at the way he does call out the metal on colossal metal
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skin colossus you know there's a lot of thought and planning and analyzing in
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there and one episode is turning into like how awesome is alex ross well let
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me but let me but let me just flip back to me okay then that's what you want to do.
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Yeah, let's do that. Alex, I can make a compliment because he liked what I did.
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He was happy. He was happy with what I did.
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Marvel seemed to be happy with what I did. They used my work to announce the project.
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They sneaked both of my big... I have a 10-page story. It has two splash pages.
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They showed both the splash pages right off the bat, which I was kind of not happy about.
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They kind of, you know, they sort of like blew the wad there a little early.
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But at the same time, I mean, there was such a great response to it that I was
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like, okay, all right, fine.
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Alex paid me, one of the compliments that he paid me was, he said,
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I noticed the way that you figured out Cyclops' visor and the way it works,
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the way that Dave Cockrum imagined it working is not the way I imagined it.
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He said, you solved it in a way I never have.
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And that was it. That was like the best thing that I could think was like,
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wow, that's really cool. How lucky was I?
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You know? And that was just all about like, okay, how does this thing work?
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And, you know, when you're trying to draw something you've never drawn before,
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you should try and analyze it a little bit to understand it.
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I'm not saying I do that for everything, but for some reason, I got that part right.
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And I hope that people, a lot of people have told me who've seen the work,
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they say, wow, there's a lot of Dave Cockrum in there.
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I personally really don't see the Dave Cockrum because I wasn't trying so hard
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to do Dave Cockrum, which is easy. You could draw Wolverine's face a certain way.
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You can draw all the characters' faces a certain way. I didn't really do that.
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I think the fact that there's so much primary colors in there and all these
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These characters are kind of crowded together.
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That invokes that time period. And when you guys see the book next month,
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it comes out in November, check it out. It's Marvel number two.
359
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Yeah. And then you did a variant cover for it too, right? I think that. Yeah.
360
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The stores have to order 25 and then one of your variant covers becomes available to them.
361
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Yeah. At the time, Alex hadn't actually painted a second cover.
362
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He'd only painted one cover for the series so far. And I guess he hadn't really
363
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spoken to him about doing the
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rest. Although I just assumed he was doing them all. And I think he is.
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So he said, well, maybe you should do the cover for issue two. I was like, okay.
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I mean, are you doing it? I don't know. They haven't even talked to me about
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it. So then like a month or so later, this was like in November,
368
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I guess the editor said, do you want to do a variant cover? And I was like, yeah, sure.
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So I did. So I went back and did the X-Men. I'd been off of the X-Men for that
370
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story for about a month or so before I went back to it.
371
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And it was a lot easier because I was more, more,
372
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you know, familiar with the characters and how things work and you're painting them.
373
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But that cover is a one in 100, actually. Oh, one in 100.
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So yeah, a retailer has to order 100 copies to get one of those,
375
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which I'm not happy about, to be honest.
376
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I mean, that means that how many people, that means that less than one out of
377
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100 people who buy the book are going to see that cover. Yeah.
378
00:25:35,312 --> 00:25:36,932
I mean, you can see it online anytime you want.
379
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But you know all the people say oh it makes it more collectible that doesn't
380
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help me you know right yeah i think that's
381
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an interesting point of the idea of collectible versus
382
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getting it out there right because it's like i i buy comics weekly
383
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and it's nice to see like oh you know i got this cover
384
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that's one out of hundred but then when you think about it's kind
385
00:25:54,972 --> 00:25:57,912
of your point it's like well how many people have got to see the beauty
386
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of that cover right like not that many and it's like or
387
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how many people even get the chance to even have it really not that many right
388
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and what sucks even more so is that all these uh
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comic shops they end up charging you know you know
390
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after market price of whatever would be and it's just like you know yeah i get
391
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why they do that but at the same time yeah it's a sales technique to get now
392
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what's flattering the flattering part of it is i guess is that they thought
393
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that what i had done was special enough to be an incentive toward copies.
394
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You know, I was just hoping I could get a bunch, you know, myself.
395
00:26:35,652 --> 00:26:38,492
You know, I could get a quantity of them. It actually turns out that there's
396
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a comic book chain that orders in really high...
397
00:26:43,052 --> 00:26:49,772
Guys, I'm on a podcast. Hey! Sorry. Maybe gave a... Go downstairs.
398
00:26:50,712 --> 00:26:53,612
Now. now i'll leave that in
399
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no okay go i
400
00:27:00,012 --> 00:27:06,732
know he knows now anyway maybe we are clear now i thought they knew so what's
401
00:27:06,732 --> 00:27:11,532
it so what's your when you're working on your own book like like nocturnals
402
00:27:11,532 --> 00:27:17,672
and then working on the story like this marvel x-men story you're doing obviously
403
00:27:17,672 --> 00:27:19,472
i would assume you have more,
404
00:27:19,512 --> 00:27:23,632
there's more feeling and interest when you're doing a nocturnal book,
405
00:27:23,952 --> 00:27:25,592
that's your own kind of baby, right?
406
00:27:26,352 --> 00:27:29,312
Yeah. You know, that's obviously that's true. I mean, that's,
407
00:27:29,312 --> 00:27:33,052
you can't get around the fact that these characters are very personal.
408
00:27:33,692 --> 00:27:38,132
However, when it came to choosing what I was going to do for the anthology,
409
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I, the first character, I thought it was Conan.
410
00:27:41,292 --> 00:27:43,892
They said, you can't do Conan. That's, that's the only one we can't do.
411
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I was like, oh, okay, now what do I do then?
412
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And, you know, really it was kind of wide open there. You know,
413
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I think Steve Root had chosen the Fantastic Four and, but there were so many
414
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other things that no one had chosen the X-Men.
415
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And, and I thought, you know, that could be kind of, and Alex was like,
416
00:27:59,192 --> 00:28:00,752
yeah, you could sell those pages easy.
417
00:28:01,532 --> 00:28:04,092
It's like, well, I wasn't really thinking about that, but I guess,
418
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you know, I could have done 10 splash pages, but I.
419
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When I thought about going back to that point in time, it was very personal
420
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to me because as a kid, that stuff was huge for me.
421
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And that was a huge deal because when I was reading comics, that was a book
422
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of new characters that no one had seen before.
423
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I mean, I remember seeing Wolverine when he showed up in the Hulk and being
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really excited that the Wolverine was back in X-Men.
425
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Yeah. And that was pretty cool because, I mean, up till then,
426
00:28:40,926 --> 00:28:45,086
I was just reading comics about characters that had been around before I even got into comics.
427
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Ghost Rider, Thor, Fantastic Four, Hulk, Avengers, Captain America, whatever.
428
00:28:50,186 --> 00:28:53,326
So all those guys already existed, but these were brand new for us.
429
00:28:53,586 --> 00:28:55,946
Like when Howard the Duck number one came out, we were excited.
430
00:28:56,426 --> 00:28:59,566
I remember my friend down the street, my only other friend that collected comics
431
00:28:59,566 --> 00:29:02,286
when I was in elementary school, a kid who got me interested in comics,
432
00:29:02,466 --> 00:29:06,006
Eric Messinio, who I still can't find. Don't know where he is.
433
00:29:06,486 --> 00:29:10,746
I haven't seen him since I was 12, 11 or 12. Eric says, have you seen Howard
434
00:29:10,746 --> 00:29:11,626
the Duck? I go, what's that?
435
00:29:12,086 --> 00:29:15,686
This is a comic. I go, what is it? Like a kid comic? No, it's Marvel.
436
00:29:16,326 --> 00:29:19,526
Well, what is he? Is he a guy in a duck costume? No, he's a duck.
437
00:29:20,106 --> 00:29:25,346
I remember this conversation very explicitly because I was like dumbfounded. I didn't understand.
438
00:29:26,246 --> 00:29:32,386
You know, I hadn't seen him in a man thing. Yeah. So I somehow end up at 7-Eleven
439
00:29:32,386 --> 00:29:36,666
that week and I get a copy of number one and I'm like, God damn,
440
00:29:36,766 --> 00:29:37,886
he is a duck. Look at that.
441
00:29:38,306 --> 00:29:42,726
But Spider-Man's on the cover and it's taking place in the Marvel universe and it's okay.
442
00:29:42,826 --> 00:29:45,746
And that was a big deal because it was new. Nova number one,
443
00:29:45,846 --> 00:29:47,566
big deal. She-Hulk number one.
444
00:29:48,286 --> 00:29:50,326
Even Dazzler was kind of a big deal.
445
00:29:51,326 --> 00:29:54,626
Dazzler number one. You know, a lot of people hate on Dazzler.
446
00:29:54,726 --> 00:29:55,786
I think Dazzler's kind of cool.
447
00:29:56,206 --> 00:29:59,206
Yeah, I mean, Dazzler, I think was just, it could have just
448
00:29:59,206 --> 00:30:02,166
been done a little more it's not you know what
449
00:30:02,166 --> 00:30:05,426
i don't think i don't know who who was it was who
450
00:30:05,426 --> 00:30:08,326
was the market for dazzler if i knew who the market was
451
00:30:08,326 --> 00:30:12,186
maybe it'd be easier to figure out more the disco
452
00:30:12,186 --> 00:30:15,446
market right that's what they created well i mean was it was it was it was it
453
00:30:15,446 --> 00:30:18,926
something they thought more female you know young like teenage girls would be
454
00:30:18,926 --> 00:30:22,886
interested in or young people could be i don't know you know maybe gotcha but
455
00:30:22,886 --> 00:30:28,686
yeah disco and and and kind of of mainstream maybe definitely x-men people were
456
00:30:28,686 --> 00:30:30,366
supposed to like it but i mean you know,
457
00:30:30,926 --> 00:30:34,566
i don't know i bought the first issue that was later anyway
458
00:30:34,566 --> 00:30:37,846
so so so part of me the the kid the
459
00:30:37,846 --> 00:30:43,986
10 year old and me find this a very personal and i went back and i read reread
460
00:30:43,986 --> 00:30:46,586
a bunch of those issues to kind of get the feel of what the characters were
461
00:30:46,586 --> 00:30:49,426
like and you know how they react how they interact with each other and that
462
00:30:49,426 --> 00:30:56,186
kind of thing and you can see why thunderbird and And Sunfire left so soon because they were...
463
00:30:57,494 --> 00:31:01,134
Angry and we already had kind of an angry guy in wolverine
464
00:31:01,134 --> 00:31:04,594
so wolverine became the angry guy outsider guy
465
00:31:04,594 --> 00:31:07,774
and they trimmed and trimmed and trimmed so my the
466
00:31:07,774 --> 00:31:11,134
idea that i had when i went discussing this with alex was what
467
00:31:11,134 --> 00:31:16,134
if all the x-men who were who actually after that giant says x-men number one
468
00:31:16,134 --> 00:31:21,554
the x-men split the old x-men split off from the new x-men he's isn't even there
469
00:31:21,554 --> 00:31:25,594
although he's in my story he's an avenger at this point but i put him in the
470
00:31:25,594 --> 00:31:27,954
story So the idea was, what if all the X-Men weren't together?
471
00:31:28,114 --> 00:31:31,254
What if they had actually stayed together as one big super group?
472
00:31:31,734 --> 00:31:34,394
How would that look? How would that be? What would that look like?
473
00:31:34,734 --> 00:31:38,314
You know, what if you had them all stuck in a room together? What would happen?
474
00:31:39,054 --> 00:31:45,034
And that's, you know, that's basically the main thrust of my story is the interaction
475
00:31:45,034 --> 00:31:46,994
between them. And is this going to work?
476
00:31:48,134 --> 00:31:52,174
So it was like a slice of Marvel history that actually never took place.
477
00:31:52,674 --> 00:31:55,194
Hmm. Such a good look on it. Such a good look.
478
00:31:55,774 --> 00:31:58,994
So while I was working on it, I kept thinking, wow, this is a lot of work.
479
00:31:59,394 --> 00:32:02,614
Why is this first stage taking two weeks to do? I don't know.
480
00:32:03,194 --> 00:32:04,574
I think I felt a lot of pressure.
481
00:32:05,174 --> 00:32:08,434
And then I kept thinking, why didn't I just do death lock and kill raiding by
482
00:32:08,434 --> 00:32:10,874
killing Martians? That would have been so much easier.
483
00:32:11,174 --> 00:32:14,774
You know, rubble, flames, smoke.
484
00:32:15,494 --> 00:32:19,114
You know what I mean? So metal. I still, yeah, so metal.
485
00:32:19,174 --> 00:32:22,234
And I still would love to do that. Maybe one day I will. you feel
486
00:32:22,234 --> 00:32:24,954
a similar type of situation when you're
487
00:32:24,954 --> 00:32:27,814
starting a nocturnal story like or is that so
488
00:32:27,814 --> 00:32:30,534
much more easy for you just to jump in the nocturnals there's
489
00:32:30,534 --> 00:32:33,514
so much stuff there's so much more stuff going on in my head with these characters
490
00:32:33,514 --> 00:32:36,894
a lot of it has to do with trying to figure out sometimes trying to figure out
491
00:32:36,894 --> 00:32:39,674
what the mysteries are behind some of these characters like the newer characters
492
00:32:39,674 --> 00:32:43,514
even some of the older characters and how to fit them all into the story in
493
00:32:43,514 --> 00:32:49,254
a way that they aren't just they're not just taking up space because they're supposed to be
494
00:32:49,294 --> 00:32:51,954
there because they're a nocturnal like in the new book that i'm
495
00:32:51,954 --> 00:32:54,734
working on now that i'm 50 pages into penciling that's right
496
00:32:54,734 --> 00:32:58,354
i'm 50 pages into penciling the next nocturnal
497
00:32:58,354 --> 00:33:01,214
book that could turn out to be half or
498
00:33:01,214 --> 00:33:06,794
less or more than half of the actual finished length at this point i'm not sure
499
00:33:06,794 --> 00:33:12,154
but and is that going to be published by you or yeah yeah it'll be it'll will
500
00:33:12,154 --> 00:33:17,154
will will fund it through kickstarter and eventually it'll get collected as
501
00:33:17,154 --> 00:33:20,174
part of like a three vaults part of a a.
502
00:33:21,504 --> 00:33:26,984
An omnibus kind of thing I have to do the first. So there's two,
503
00:33:27,144 --> 00:33:29,484
two volumes worth of nocturnal stuff already.
504
00:33:29,844 --> 00:33:32,864
And then the third volume would be sinister path, which came out a couple of
505
00:33:32,864 --> 00:33:36,564
years ago and then this one, and then another one and they're kind of a trilogy.
506
00:33:36,704 --> 00:33:39,084
They all kind of work together. So that'll fit well together.
507
00:33:39,724 --> 00:33:44,364
Awesome. But on this one, there are three characters, three nocturnal characters
508
00:33:44,364 --> 00:33:49,204
on the story because there's just, there's too much.
509
00:33:49,344 --> 00:33:51,824
I mean, it's like superhero stories. is when you have a group,
510
00:33:51,844 --> 00:33:56,044
like an X-Men story or something, or Fantastic Four, X-Men, whatever it is.
511
00:33:56,344 --> 00:33:58,364
I say X-Men twice because I meant to say Avengers.
512
00:33:58,944 --> 00:34:03,244
But the point is that you have to up the ante so much when you're doing a superhero
513
00:34:03,244 --> 00:34:06,044
story because these characters are more and more powerful. Together,
514
00:34:06,124 --> 00:34:06,944
they're even more powerful.
515
00:34:07,204 --> 00:34:10,664
You have to figure out ways to kind of hamstring them to make them weaker.
516
00:34:11,124 --> 00:34:15,344
Maybe one character dies or is in a coma or goes missing or who knows what.
517
00:34:15,684 --> 00:34:19,324
All these things happen. You split them into smaller teams and things like that.
518
00:34:19,944 --> 00:34:22,764
I've done all that stuff before. I've done that in Superhero comics.
519
00:34:22,864 --> 00:34:23,824
I've done it with my internals.
520
00:34:24,164 --> 00:34:27,364
So this time I thought, what if I just take some of them out of the equation?
521
00:34:27,464 --> 00:34:31,724
I took the least supernatural characters out of the equation because this story
522
00:34:31,724 --> 00:34:34,064
is a very supernatural kind of story.
523
00:34:34,644 --> 00:34:39,224
And if I have character X, Y, and Z in there, it's too much firepower.
524
00:34:39,804 --> 00:34:43,384
You know what I mean? And then you can tell a different kind of story.
525
00:34:44,024 --> 00:34:46,784
So that's what I'm trying this time around. So it's just Doc,
526
00:34:46,844 --> 00:34:51,124
Polychrome, Gunwitch, and Eve, and then the new, and then some of the new characters
527
00:34:51,124 --> 00:34:55,444
that appeared in, um, for the first time in Cinder Shepard, it was Nix and her
528
00:34:55,444 --> 00:34:58,524
son Ajax become the Hemlock family.
529
00:34:58,644 --> 00:35:01,724
The Hemlock family are like the nocturnals that nobody knew about.
530
00:35:02,024 --> 00:35:06,584
They could have been around all this time, but our nocturnals never interacted
531
00:35:06,584 --> 00:35:09,904
with their nocturnal. Well, actually one of them did, but wasn't talking about it.
532
00:35:11,115 --> 00:35:14,595
And that's probably really confusing for people that haven't read Sinister Path, but go read it.
533
00:35:14,655 --> 00:35:18,135
You can, you know, go to Bud's, no, not, no, go to bigwow.com,
534
00:35:18,235 --> 00:35:22,835
bigwowart.com, and you can order it straight from us. Awesome. Straight from us.
535
00:35:23,435 --> 00:35:28,875
Since your Nocturnals are so rich in story, would you ever want to see it?
536
00:35:28,995 --> 00:35:32,395
Or has it ever been talked about being into a television show or a movie?
537
00:35:33,375 --> 00:35:37,635
You get bites on the line all the time. I mean, since the book first came out
538
00:35:37,635 --> 00:35:43,055
in 94 and 95, I've had interest from different producers and things like that.
539
00:35:43,115 --> 00:35:52,835
The first person to call me about Nocturnals was a producer who worked for Richard Donner.
540
00:35:53,495 --> 00:35:57,155
And he was very interested in the work of a screenwriter named Andrew Kevin
541
00:35:57,155 --> 00:36:00,935
Walker, who had just written a film that was about to come out called Seven.
542
00:36:01,435 --> 00:36:04,435
So when they contacted me, Seven hadn't come out yet. And they sent me a copy
543
00:36:04,435 --> 00:36:08,535
of the script. to me. So we'd like to get this guy's eyes on Nocturnals and
544
00:36:08,535 --> 00:36:09,415
see what he would come up with.
545
00:36:09,975 --> 00:36:16,335
And I was like, great. And then my attorney, who's like my sort of entertainment
546
00:36:16,335 --> 00:36:19,555
lawyer, came back to me and said, well, they want a free option.
547
00:36:19,655 --> 00:36:20,895
We're not getting out any free options.
548
00:36:22,155 --> 00:36:26,055
And I understand all that. It's kind of how business works.
549
00:36:26,175 --> 00:36:28,255
But at the same time, it would have been really cool if Andrew Kevin Walker
550
00:36:28,255 --> 00:36:30,275
had been attached to Nocturnals film.
551
00:36:30,815 --> 00:36:34,595
Because later on, he ended up writing Sleepy Hollow. wow amongst many other
552
00:36:34,595 --> 00:36:34,595
in it but if there were really spooky creepy things in that story that I thought this is exactly how.
553
00:37:03,595 --> 00:37:06,795
Going on all the time? Like a very Halloween type film. And the Sleepy Hollow
554
00:37:06,795 --> 00:37:11,795
film is like that, except there are all these elements that were cut out of Walker's script.
555
00:37:11,935 --> 00:37:14,295
When I read that script, I thought, God, he would have been perfect.
556
00:37:15,455 --> 00:37:19,215
But over the years, there have been producers who have come to me.
557
00:37:19,515 --> 00:37:20,935
They always have some pitch.
558
00:37:21,455 --> 00:37:23,815
They almost never want to pay you any money up front.
559
00:37:24,555 --> 00:37:27,155
Sometimes you give them a free option because they have credits.
560
00:37:27,775 --> 00:37:32,375
Like Don Murphy, who was a producer on Natural Born Killers and quite a few other films.
561
00:37:32,375 --> 00:37:37,735
Films he had an option for a while and usually what it means is they have a
562
00:37:37,735 --> 00:37:40,755
deal with the studio and they'll take it to that studio and they'll think they
563
00:37:40,755 --> 00:37:43,255
can set it up there and if they don't kind of lose interest.
564
00:37:44,730 --> 00:37:48,270
As far as TV goes, it's a similar kind of thing. There's people who are interested
565
00:37:48,270 --> 00:37:51,210
in doing anime and stuff, television, movies, and things like that.
566
00:37:51,670 --> 00:37:55,010
You would think a streaming platform would be a good option for that, right?
567
00:37:55,070 --> 00:37:59,450
Like a Netflix. Yeah, I mean, I don't think there's any medium where you couldn't
568
00:37:59,450 --> 00:38:01,010
do a cool Nocturnals thing.
569
00:38:01,510 --> 00:38:06,310
Maybe I'm biased, but for me, the Nocturnals is a comic that I wanted to see.
570
00:38:07,750 --> 00:38:11,130
I try to make a comic that I would want to read.
571
00:38:11,130 --> 00:38:13,870
And so if i if
572
00:38:13,870 --> 00:38:17,010
i'm a comic book fan who likes most of the stuff that we all like i
573
00:38:17,010 --> 00:38:22,530
can't see why it would be a loser i mean i'm talking with a with a producer
574
00:38:22,530 --> 00:38:27,330
right now about it nice there was one that was one you told me a while back
575
00:38:27,330 --> 00:38:31,450
my excitement though you know what i mean for the green until there's a green
576
00:38:31,450 --> 00:38:36,470
light down the road i just reserve i i i can't let myself get crazy
577
00:38:36,650 --> 00:38:39,990
excited about it i mean you used to do that you know yeah but
578
00:38:39,990 --> 00:38:42,870
it's just it's like it's like it's like working it's like
579
00:38:42,870 --> 00:38:45,890
panning for gold and working a claim you you
580
00:38:45,890 --> 00:38:49,510
just got to keep working at it and working at it and until you find the color
581
00:38:49,510 --> 00:38:54,370
you know yeah and sometimes you don't find it so the way i look at it is i've
582
00:38:54,370 --> 00:38:58,330
got this claim over here you want to go work it go ahead and work it i'm going
583
00:38:58,330 --> 00:39:02,830
to concentrate on on what i can control in my world which is doing comics and
584
00:39:02,830 --> 00:39:05,510
and doing artwork and telling the stories that I can tell.
585
00:39:05,690 --> 00:39:09,330
And if someone comes along and wants to do nocturnals, and believe me,
586
00:39:09,370 --> 00:39:11,630
they come along and they talk a good talk, man.
587
00:39:11,790 --> 00:39:15,290
They'll get really excited about it. And then nothing happens.
588
00:39:16,610 --> 00:39:21,910
Can you mention someone who you did some work with that was a musician that
589
00:39:21,910 --> 00:39:24,870
was possibly interested in doing a nocturnals movie?
590
00:39:25,270 --> 00:39:30,010
Can we mention that? Yeah, Rob called. You can call me, email me once.
591
00:39:30,010 --> 00:39:34,130
This was i think it was after maybe the first or second halloween film had come
592
00:39:34,130 --> 00:39:38,930
out and he said hey what's your number i what's your current phone number i
593
00:39:38,930 --> 00:39:40,190
think i want to do a nocturnals movie,
594
00:39:40,830 --> 00:39:45,250
and i was like oh you know because i rob has just done halloween too or whatever
595
00:39:45,250 --> 00:39:49,910
so i mean we're talking about for those that don't know rob zombie right artwork
596
00:39:49,910 --> 00:39:55,550
yeah i didn't catch i love you did some artwork for two of his albums albums
597
00:39:55,550 --> 00:39:58,390
right that's right yes i did for Did you? I didn't know that.
598
00:39:58,450 --> 00:40:01,770
You did artwork for Rob Zombie, huh? Yeah, I did the cover of the CD booklet
599
00:40:01,770 --> 00:40:04,670
for, not the cover of the CD, that's Basil Gogos.
600
00:40:04,850 --> 00:40:08,830
But the cover of the CD booklet for Hellbilly Deluxe, his first solo album. Wow.
601
00:40:09,130 --> 00:40:13,630
And then he did Hellbilly Deluxe 2 some years later, and then I did a piece
602
00:40:13,630 --> 00:40:15,350
in there, like a gatefold piece in there.
603
00:40:15,630 --> 00:40:18,070
Wow, imagine Rob Zombie doing nocturnals. Holy crap.
604
00:40:18,950 --> 00:40:25,270
Well, he was a fan of nocturnals. He did an intro for one of the books back in the late 90s.
605
00:40:25,270 --> 00:40:30,650
He and I talked about doing a Rob Zombie versus the Nocturnals comic wow and
606
00:40:30,650 --> 00:40:34,190
then you know he got this idea in the early 2000s that he wanted to do a Nocturnals
607
00:40:34,190 --> 00:40:38,130
film or you know so I let myself be excited for like 10 minutes,
608
00:40:38,890 --> 00:40:43,310
I was like wow that would be cool and again that's it'd be Rob's version of
609
00:40:43,310 --> 00:40:44,570
Nocturnals not mine right,
610
00:40:45,037 --> 00:40:48,777
You know, and I understand that I get seen enough movie adaptations to know
611
00:40:48,777 --> 00:40:52,337
that you're not necessarily going to get the same thing, especially with him.
612
00:40:52,497 --> 00:40:55,497
But still, it would have been fun to see what he would have done with it.
613
00:40:56,657 --> 00:40:59,637
Can I ask, you know, it seems like you have a very specific vision.
614
00:41:00,377 --> 00:41:04,217
Would you ever want to just direct it yourself or write it yourself?
615
00:41:04,957 --> 00:41:10,337
Yes. Yeah. I actually have a screenplay that's been unfinished for a long time.
616
00:41:10,337 --> 00:41:16,297
And then I've got several different pitches where I've tweaked the Nocturnal's
617
00:41:16,297 --> 00:41:22,877
storyline or tweaked the setting or, you know, in various ways to present it
618
00:41:22,877 --> 00:41:24,997
more simply to a film audience.
619
00:41:25,237 --> 00:41:29,537
So I've spent a lot of time doing that and I don't do that anymore because it's
620
00:41:29,537 --> 00:41:32,637
time consuming and it's a waste of time until someone's paying you to do it.
621
00:41:32,697 --> 00:41:34,717
What's the point? So, I mean, yeah.
622
00:41:35,777 --> 00:41:39,337
You think maybe doing an Indiegogo for a movie would be?
623
00:41:39,897 --> 00:41:43,897
No, no, no. No, I don't think so.
624
00:41:44,037 --> 00:41:49,177
I think I put my best foot forward when it comes to doing comics.
625
00:41:49,237 --> 00:41:54,057
I'm almost 55, so I don't know that this is the time to jump into a brand new career.
626
00:41:54,337 --> 00:41:59,317
Right, sure. Although I do really get excited about the idea of doing board games.
627
00:41:59,997 --> 00:42:02,877
That's something that I would like to do. That'd be cool. I could see a Nocturnal's
628
00:42:02,877 --> 00:42:07,217
board game. Yeah, I would like to do board games with my IP...
629
00:42:08,578 --> 00:42:13,498
It's something I've been talking, I've been working with a game designer and
630
00:42:13,498 --> 00:42:16,818
we're actually working on a Nocturnal's card game right now.
631
00:42:16,938 --> 00:42:22,318
It's not like a Magic the Gathering type of thing, but you can play a different
632
00:42:22,318 --> 00:42:25,958
Nocturnal's character and it would be, but it's something that would be a lot
633
00:42:25,958 --> 00:42:27,638
easier to learn than Magic the Gathering.
634
00:42:27,718 --> 00:42:31,658
I don't know if Magic the Gathering is easy or hard to learn. I don't know, but.
635
00:42:32,098 --> 00:42:36,058
It's easier now, I can tell you that, but it was, yeah, it's still pretty hard.
636
00:42:36,658 --> 00:42:39,358
We're talking about doing that and we're talking about like we're you
637
00:42:39,358 --> 00:42:42,798
know we have a board game that we're that we've got in development really the
638
00:42:42,798 --> 00:42:45,818
thing with the board games is you have to have you have
639
00:42:45,818 --> 00:42:48,778
to have some some capital to to
640
00:42:48,778 --> 00:42:51,638
do those figures because the miniatures are important
641
00:42:51,638 --> 00:42:57,478
to me i want to do miniatures of characters and they have to be sculpted and
642
00:42:57,478 --> 00:43:01,238
i don't know how to do that right so we have to come up with the capital to
643
00:43:01,238 --> 00:43:04,718
to afford to put the miniatures out there so people can see what they're going
644
00:43:04,718 --> 00:43:07,718
to get although you can't just say oh there's any cool miniatures Give us some
645
00:43:07,718 --> 00:43:09,798
money. It doesn't work that way. Right, right. Obviously.
646
00:43:10,198 --> 00:43:13,258
You know what's interesting is, do you play video games yourself or no?
647
00:43:13,678 --> 00:43:17,578
No. I can't. I get too caught into it and then I don't get any work done.
648
00:43:17,818 --> 00:43:20,938
Gotcha. So are you aware of a developer called Telltale Games?
649
00:43:21,798 --> 00:43:25,778
Video games? No, probably not. So I bring them up because Telltale is,
650
00:43:25,858 --> 00:43:27,878
they're known for making the Walking Dead video game.
651
00:43:28,398 --> 00:43:32,178
Basically a bunch of comic book video games in an important click adventure
652
00:43:32,178 --> 00:43:36,218
world. And so when I first played Fable, they made one by, I'm sure you know
653
00:43:36,218 --> 00:43:38,438
Fable from DC, right? Sure. Or Fable, sorry.
654
00:43:39,098 --> 00:43:43,718
Yeah. They did one for Fables and it's phenomenal. And when I played that the
655
00:43:43,718 --> 00:43:48,478
whole time, one of the thoughts I've had was like, wow, what if Telltale did
656
00:43:48,478 --> 00:43:50,318
a Nocturnals video game?
657
00:43:50,438 --> 00:43:54,518
So my question is, what if there was a way to make a Nocturnals video game?
658
00:43:55,078 --> 00:43:57,698
Because I feel like that your property is perfect for that.
659
00:43:58,819 --> 00:44:03,719
Again, it's just sort of like, well, you know, a lot of this stuff happens when
660
00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:08,659
a book has popularity and has really strong sales.
661
00:44:09,179 --> 00:44:16,879
And I don't do nocturnals in a periodical fashion to where that's a thing.
662
00:44:16,979 --> 00:44:19,899
You know what I mean? Right, right. If I was doing a monthly nocturnals book
663
00:44:19,899 --> 00:44:25,439
through a publisher, or even a bi-monthly book through a publisher,
664
00:44:25,959 --> 00:44:30,539
we have a hell of a lot better chance of getting the sales up to get the attention
665
00:44:30,539 --> 00:44:34,099
of licensors who would want to do things like that.
666
00:44:34,339 --> 00:44:41,219
I am in talks with an RPG company about doing a version of Nocturnals as an
667
00:44:41,219 --> 00:44:46,479
RPG, but it's not a Nocturnals RPG game. It would be a source book that you
668
00:44:46,479 --> 00:44:49,199
play in a pre-existing RPG.
669
00:44:49,599 --> 00:44:51,419
When you say RPG, do you mean tabletop?
670
00:44:51,879 --> 00:44:56,999
Not a board game, but yeah. Like D&D style? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly.
671
00:44:57,259 --> 00:45:01,239
It'd be like if there was Dungeons & Dragons, but a Nocturnal source book.
672
00:45:01,359 --> 00:45:03,539
So you could play the Nocturnal's world with Dungeons & Dragons.
673
00:45:04,019 --> 00:45:07,979
That seems to be a common trend now, because I know there's a movie coming called
674
00:45:07,979 --> 00:45:11,639
Green Something, and they're doing the same thing. It's from A24.
675
00:45:11,919 --> 00:45:15,059
Green Ronin? maybe that might have been it i can't remember but it was green
676
00:45:15,059 --> 00:45:18,939
ronin green ronin did a game called mutants and mastermind back in the early
677
00:45:18,939 --> 00:45:21,579
2000s and they did a nocturnal source book.
678
00:45:22,119 --> 00:45:26,239
To play you could play you could play the mutants and masterminds game in the
679
00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:29,619
nocturnal world but we did a source book for that and i'm talking with them
680
00:45:29,619 --> 00:45:32,959
again about doing the same thing with this rpg that they're now that they're
681
00:45:32,959 --> 00:45:36,639
now doing but i can't really talk too much about that because we're not even
682
00:45:36,639 --> 00:45:40,119
like in the we're not we're not in early stages of talking about that absolutely Absolutely.
683
00:45:40,599 --> 00:45:44,219
But I like those guys. They're down to earth. They put out good product and
684
00:45:44,219 --> 00:45:45,379
it's very simple and clean.
685
00:45:46,259 --> 00:45:49,139
I mean, I'm up for all these kinds of things. I think it would be fun,
686
00:45:49,219 --> 00:45:54,899
you know, but the problem is, is if you get too caught up in that and then you start comparing...
687
00:45:56,074 --> 00:45:58,874
In yourself like well how come i don't have a tv show or
688
00:45:58,874 --> 00:46:01,654
how come i don't have this how come i don't have that really none of
689
00:46:01,654 --> 00:46:04,494
that stuff matters i mean there's a lot of people who get adaptations that
690
00:46:04,494 --> 00:46:10,554
are not that great yeah you know but it is hard as an artist to see especially
691
00:46:10,554 --> 00:46:15,154
when you know people or you've like kind of come up in the same aisles at comic
692
00:46:15,154 --> 00:46:19,154
cons doing art with these people and then all of a sudden you see one of them
693
00:46:19,154 --> 00:46:24,454
has a show on hulu or one of them's doing a Nate Page story in heavy metal or something like that.
694
00:46:24,594 --> 00:46:28,874
And there is this kind of, for me, and I don't know if you feel it too,
695
00:46:28,974 --> 00:46:33,574
but like, it's almost like I feel like my career is slipping away from me or
696
00:46:33,574 --> 00:46:35,514
I made the wrong move somewhere.
697
00:46:35,694 --> 00:46:40,514
And it's hard not to go down a slide. It just like, yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about.
698
00:46:40,634 --> 00:46:44,114
And then, you know, I used to, I used to get caught up in that a lot more.
699
00:46:45,514 --> 00:46:51,014
I just have to walk into a comic shop and look at the rack and see the covers
700
00:46:51,014 --> 00:46:53,854
and the project that I hadn't been called for.
701
00:46:54,314 --> 00:46:59,094
Right. I could have really done, I could have really knocked that one out of
702
00:46:59,094 --> 00:47:01,094
the park. You know, oh, I would have loved to have done that one.
703
00:47:01,254 --> 00:47:03,854
But you know what? Everybody gets that feeling.
704
00:47:04,034 --> 00:47:06,914
You know, I mean, who doesn't get that feeling? Very few people.
705
00:47:07,674 --> 00:47:13,434
The thing is, is you have your own trajectory and you have to follow your trajectory your way.
706
00:47:13,894 --> 00:47:18,534
And if you're happy, you know, like, okay, you know, I don't have the fame of
707
00:47:18,534 --> 00:47:24,534
some other comic book people, but I'm comfortable right now and I'm not stressed out. I'm not unhappy.
708
00:47:26,924 --> 00:47:31,264
I have built up a decent fan base over the years that I can put out a Kickstarter
709
00:47:31,264 --> 00:47:33,804
art book, or I can put out a graphic novel, whatever it is.
710
00:47:33,964 --> 00:47:37,724
And it's not going to fall flat in its face for lack of interest.
711
00:47:38,504 --> 00:47:41,664
And that is nothing to sneeze at.
712
00:47:42,144 --> 00:47:45,304
You could always look at someone else's Kickstarter. I mean,
713
00:47:45,344 --> 00:47:48,804
there's people out there who no one has ever heard of who are doing comic book
714
00:47:48,804 --> 00:47:54,004
Kickstarters that are going crazy gangbusters, right? But why?
715
00:47:54,784 --> 00:47:57,724
Sometimes it's the the subject matter sometimes because they have
716
00:47:57,724 --> 00:48:00,504
40 variant covers of women in various stages of
717
00:48:00,504 --> 00:48:03,344
undress yeah oh that's so true yeah that
718
00:48:03,344 --> 00:48:06,304
is not yeah is that your trajectory it's not my trajectory
719
00:48:06,304 --> 00:48:11,444
if i wanted to do that i could do that right you know i i don't want to be known
720
00:48:11,444 --> 00:48:16,524
as that it's not of interest to me so right you mentioned our book thing and
721
00:48:16,524 --> 00:48:20,444
keep you got to be you got to just be true to your to your to yourself and into
722
00:48:20,444 --> 00:48:24,524
your your i don't want to say art because we're telling stories.
723
00:48:24,624 --> 00:48:28,784
So you have stories that you want to tell to, you got to just tell them to the best of your ability.
724
00:48:28,924 --> 00:48:32,764
And one of the things I really admire about you, Mike, is the fact that you
725
00:48:32,764 --> 00:48:38,584
didn't let a lot of things stop you from putting out a ton of work over your
726
00:48:38,584 --> 00:48:41,084
lifetime. So far, you've put out a lot of comic book work.
727
00:48:41,344 --> 00:48:46,084
When you want something, you do it, you make time for it. And so many people don't do that.
728
00:48:46,484 --> 00:48:52,984
You know, some of us wait until some Some editor says, yes, we're going to hire you to do this thing.
729
00:48:53,204 --> 00:48:56,024
And then you sit there and you think, wow, well, I guess no editor's interested
730
00:48:56,024 --> 00:48:59,284
in the story I want to do, so it'll never get done. Well, that might be true.
731
00:48:59,524 --> 00:49:04,544
But then maybe what if you didn't have to wait for an editor or a publisher
732
00:49:04,544 --> 00:49:07,444
to be interested in publishing you or paying you?
733
00:49:08,264 --> 00:49:11,184
Because a lot of them will publish you if they don't have to pay you up front.
734
00:49:11,824 --> 00:49:17,684
Heck, most of them will. well. But what if there was a way that you could reach
735
00:49:17,684 --> 00:49:21,404
an audience and you didn't have to worry about what a publisher thought or whether
736
00:49:21,404 --> 00:49:25,484
or not they wanted to do it or whether they were going to bankroll it or if
737
00:49:25,484 --> 00:49:26,704
there was anyone that was going to buy it?
738
00:49:27,528 --> 00:49:30,728
I'll tell you, Kickstarter has completely changed the game for a lot of us.
739
00:49:31,188 --> 00:49:36,308
I mean, my outlook on things has never been as exciting as when...
740
00:49:36,308 --> 00:49:39,408
I mean, the last time I got this excited about doing comics or doing anything
741
00:49:39,408 --> 00:49:45,548
was in the early 90s when I was doing Nocturnals.
742
00:49:45,548 --> 00:49:49,088
And I thought, wow, I mean, so I can just do... I can come up with a concept
743
00:49:49,088 --> 00:49:53,308
and I can do the comic and they'll pay me to do it.
744
00:49:53,668 --> 00:49:58,328
And I had that one more time with Giant Killer in 99. and then never again.
745
00:49:58,868 --> 00:50:01,508
You know what I mean? Well, that's not necessarily true. I mean,
746
00:50:01,568 --> 00:50:05,968
I worked with Oney on Dark Forever, Nocturnals Dark Forever, and Outskirts of Doom.
747
00:50:06,268 --> 00:50:10,328
But those opportunities don't come very often and they haven't come since 2000,
748
00:50:10,528 --> 00:50:15,748
I guess, where I had something that was personal to me that I took to someone
749
00:50:15,748 --> 00:50:18,528
and said, here, I want to do this. And they said, yeah, okay, we'll fund that.
750
00:50:18,768 --> 00:50:22,228
You know, that's just, it's up to me to do that now.
751
00:50:22,328 --> 00:50:25,888
And I have a way to do it with Kickstarter. starter so i have
752
00:50:25,888 --> 00:50:28,928
a base of people who are who are who
753
00:50:28,928 --> 00:50:31,888
are waiting for me to do something and then
754
00:50:31,888 --> 00:50:34,628
there's a group of people who are new to things that come
755
00:50:34,628 --> 00:50:37,508
in later and then every time you do something you just hopefully
756
00:50:37,508 --> 00:50:41,268
add more people on to that that the audience and
757
00:50:41,268 --> 00:50:44,268
really it's about building your audience and and maintaining that
758
00:50:44,268 --> 00:50:47,108
on you and you've done you definitely have a
759
00:50:47,108 --> 00:50:50,868
following of fans who love nocturnal
760
00:50:50,868 --> 00:50:54,328
love your art i mean i'm one of them by how gunwitch tattooed
761
00:50:54,328 --> 00:50:57,348
on my arm yeah that's right many other people i
762
00:50:57,348 --> 00:51:00,208
have seen with with nocturnals tattoos as well
763
00:51:00,208 --> 00:51:08,108
but and you've released several nocturnals hardcovers and and also art books
764
00:51:08,108 --> 00:51:12,528
and you mentioned kickstarter and you just wrapped up kickstarter correct with
765
00:51:12,528 --> 00:51:20,008
a new art book children of the night yeah i i've been doing i mean what's going on nothing nothing.
766
00:51:21,348 --> 00:51:24,508
There's something in the background you're saying it's entertaining let's hear
767
00:51:24,508 --> 00:51:27,948
it no no you're fine you're going i don't want people to get bored so yeah enough
768
00:51:27,948 --> 00:51:35,808
to do okay i think she just walked out of the shower anyways anyways continual
769
00:51:35,808 --> 00:51:41,628
dad so i was gonna i was just gonna say i i've been Okay,
770
00:51:41,828 --> 00:51:50,548
so I've been doing art books now for, I don't know, probably, I want to say 10 years.
771
00:51:50,748 --> 00:51:55,228
The first one, the first major color hardcover art book I put out through Image
772
00:51:55,228 --> 00:51:57,048
was, I think, in 2010 or 2011.
773
00:51:58,008 --> 00:52:00,648
And it was called The Goddess and the Monster. You can still find it.
774
00:52:01,108 --> 00:52:03,668
Actually, you can't. It's not in print, but you can still find it.
775
00:52:04,588 --> 00:52:09,588
And that was like kind of like 20-year retrospective of my stuff at that point,
776
00:52:09,648 --> 00:52:10,668
maybe more than 20 years.
777
00:52:11,268 --> 00:52:14,548
And after that, I put out a few more.
778
00:52:15,988 --> 00:52:20,268
Hardcover art book collections with Big Wow Art, Steve Morgan, Big Wow Art.
779
00:52:20,388 --> 00:52:24,028
We put out Siren, Sorceress, Enchantress.
780
00:52:24,868 --> 00:52:29,648
And Enchantress was my first Kickstarter. And then after Enchantress Kickstarter,
781
00:52:29,948 --> 00:52:31,548
we did the Nocturnal's graphic novel Kickstarter.
782
00:52:31,848 --> 00:52:35,328
And then I've done three or four art books since then. I've done Mercenary.
783
00:52:35,728 --> 00:52:39,548
Then we did, I'm sorry, it's hard to keep track. Did Mercenary.
784
00:52:39,948 --> 00:52:43,128
Then we did Night Studio, In the Night Studio.
785
00:52:43,128 --> 00:52:45,928
Studio and after in the night studio we did night
786
00:52:45,928 --> 00:52:48,948
owls and then this year's kickstarter was
787
00:52:48,948 --> 00:52:51,588
children of night are you sensing that there's a
788
00:52:51,588 --> 00:52:56,148
theme i think there might be a theme there yeah but the
789
00:52:56,148 --> 00:53:00,428
uh the one we just finished was different from the other ones in that it had
790
00:53:00,428 --> 00:53:07,008
a a companion item which was an art portfolio called october lands and so october
791
00:53:07,008 --> 00:53:13,588
lands had some new stuff and some classic stuff that we put into a sort of like, you know, Halloween,
792
00:53:13,748 --> 00:53:15,908
October sort of feel portfolio.
793
00:53:16,728 --> 00:53:22,088
And that also did really well. I love the portfolio format and I've been trying
794
00:53:22,088 --> 00:53:24,968
to kind of play around in that as much as I can in the last couple of years.
795
00:53:25,028 --> 00:53:31,188
We did a Nocturnal's Art Portfolio in 2017 and the Oktoberlands one is still available.
796
00:53:31,308 --> 00:53:34,888
And even though the Kickstarter for the book and the portfolio are over,
797
00:53:35,048 --> 00:53:37,308
if you go to the Kickstarter for Children of Night,
798
00:53:37,868 --> 00:53:40,788
there's a link on the page that takes you to
799
00:53:40,788 --> 00:53:43,608
my fulfillment people which is sidekick labs they actually
800
00:53:43,608 --> 00:53:47,168
print the trading cards that we've done like creeping flesh and the nocturnal
801
00:53:47,168 --> 00:53:50,588
trading card set and thank you mars attacks and things like that so they are
802
00:53:50,588 --> 00:53:53,528
going to be running the survey store so you can actually get on their mailing
803
00:53:53,528 --> 00:53:57,928
list right now and you and they'll let you know when the survey store is open
804
00:53:57,928 --> 00:54:01,708
so that you can get the book you get the portfolio we have other many
805
00:54:01,808 --> 00:54:05,288
other items on there that we're adding on. Cards, trading card sets.
806
00:54:05,948 --> 00:54:11,408
We actually expanded the portfolio of another 19 plates that you could choose
807
00:54:11,408 --> 00:54:16,128
from with two more illustrated envelopes. So if you wanted to get.
808
00:54:17,788 --> 00:54:21,868
Almost 30 pieces, you could do that. You can build it up.
809
00:54:22,208 --> 00:54:25,988
And now I think they all, I'm not sure if they all come signed. I think they do though.
810
00:54:27,488 --> 00:54:31,388
Yeah. It's fun looking at some of your books, you know, your art books.
811
00:54:31,448 --> 00:54:35,188
And I've, I know one of the ways that you work when you're doing your,
812
00:54:35,188 --> 00:54:39,808
your paintings and drawings is that you'll use people to pose in the positions
813
00:54:39,808 --> 00:54:43,088
that you want to, to create in the, in the book.
814
00:54:47,368 --> 00:54:50,488
And Yeah, you'll see it somewhere. Yeah.
815
00:54:50,628 --> 00:54:54,728
Yeah. I've been, I, that was the thing that in art school that they would always
816
00:54:54,728 --> 00:54:57,528
give you, you know, when I was an illustration major in art school,
817
00:54:57,608 --> 00:55:02,488
I went to CCAC in Oakland and then I transferred over to the Academy after two
818
00:55:02,488 --> 00:55:04,808
and a half years and finished my time there.
819
00:55:04,928 --> 00:55:09,988
And one of the big things with these contemporary illustrators who are teaching
820
00:55:09,988 --> 00:55:14,308
a lot of these courses was what they call scrap and scrap is photo reference.
821
00:55:14,728 --> 00:55:18,948
And so if you turn in a piece they would look at the hand and go did you shoot
822
00:55:18,948 --> 00:55:23,828
scrap for that hand and you'd be like no and they go well you could tell because
823
00:55:23,828 --> 00:55:27,208
that hand is weak one better drawing in that hand.
824
00:55:27,848 --> 00:55:32,048
And so for them it was about hiring models or getting people in your family
825
00:55:32,048 --> 00:55:35,608
or friends to model for you shooting the photo reference and working from that
826
00:55:35,608 --> 00:55:39,148
so that everything looks accurate and no art directors are going to point at
827
00:55:39,148 --> 00:55:42,648
it or editors are going to point out and go go, that's funky. Can you fix that?
828
00:55:43,148 --> 00:55:47,868
And it's about skill and draftsmanship. And we were doing lots and lots of life
829
00:55:47,868 --> 00:55:51,068
drawing and painting from models and all that kind of stuff,
830
00:55:51,228 --> 00:55:53,968
you know, all day long, every day we were doing that.
831
00:55:54,168 --> 00:55:58,068
So you were working for models in the studio at school and you were photographing
832
00:55:58,068 --> 00:55:59,488
models for the work you were doing.
833
00:55:59,608 --> 00:56:05,388
And so when it came time to do comics, it was a natural progression.
834
00:56:05,488 --> 00:56:11,008
And what was kind of cool about it was some artists are better at drawing types than others.
835
00:56:11,388 --> 00:56:15,208
Some artists have kind of a generic face they draw and they add a mustache or
836
00:56:15,208 --> 00:56:18,468
a certain color hair or a hat or glasses or a scar, whatever,
837
00:56:18,648 --> 00:56:21,468
you know, maybe they give them a big nose or a little nose, whatever, or no nose.
838
00:56:21,968 --> 00:56:25,908
They have these types, these archetypes, which is fine, you know,
839
00:56:25,928 --> 00:56:29,288
but then there's people who draw people that look real to you.
840
00:56:29,328 --> 00:56:32,788
Like Gene Colan's art, when he draws a person, that person looks like a real person.
841
00:56:32,988 --> 00:56:35,108
It's because usually it was based on somebody.
842
00:56:35,728 --> 00:56:38,328
And that's the same when you look at Norman in the Rockwell's work,
843
00:56:38,388 --> 00:56:42,888
Dean Cornwell, or I'm going back and back into the Golden Age of Illustration,
844
00:56:42,928 --> 00:56:46,588
but anytime, look at Drew Sturzen, the movie poster guy.
845
00:56:46,748 --> 00:56:49,568
Drew Sturzen's working for him in photo reference, obviously when he's doing
846
00:56:49,568 --> 00:56:52,368
Indiana Jones or whoever he's doing in a poster.
847
00:56:53,528 --> 00:56:55,508
So that helps inform.
848
00:56:56,804 --> 00:57:02,184
And tell the story with even more power and strength. And it's fun because you
849
00:57:02,184 --> 00:57:06,024
get your friends together and your family together and you're telling a story
850
00:57:06,024 --> 00:57:09,124
together and you're doing a shoot and it feels,
851
00:57:09,184 --> 00:57:11,884
and it's not like making necessarily like making a film, but it's very close
852
00:57:11,884 --> 00:57:13,924
to it because you want people to emote.
853
00:57:14,264 --> 00:57:18,204
You want, it's not just taking a position where put your hand here.
854
00:57:18,264 --> 00:57:21,344
I need some of that, but you know, lighting and things like the lighting,
855
00:57:21,384 --> 00:57:23,404
super important when you're shooting reference for things.
856
00:57:23,504 --> 00:57:27,184
I mean, lighting is really important in my work. And so I want to get the lighting, lighting, right.
857
00:57:27,304 --> 00:57:30,264
And so one of the things that's fascinating to me is throwing the light on a
858
00:57:30,264 --> 00:57:34,664
subject and watching how it changes and how you can get emotional about something
859
00:57:34,664 --> 00:57:36,904
based on the lighting alone. Yeah.
860
00:57:38,664 --> 00:57:44,464
Shadows light. That stuff is so important to, to storytelling.
861
00:57:44,784 --> 00:57:49,384
Well, especially with yours, because your, your work is so, it's such a feeling
862
00:57:49,384 --> 00:57:52,084
when, when you look at the colors that you use.
863
00:57:52,084 --> 00:57:55,444
And then like i i senior i
864
00:57:55,444 --> 00:57:58,764
met your dad but it's really fun to to see a character in
865
00:57:58,764 --> 00:58:02,204
in your i see your dad in the yeah the stories
866
00:58:02,204 --> 00:58:07,664
are often and it's my revenge on my my parents is to put them in comics actually
867
00:58:07,664 --> 00:58:12,084
they like it but when i was a kid they didn't understand my obsession with comics
868
00:58:12,084 --> 00:58:19,284
they were a little scared by it so i feel like those parents were rotting my brain one of
869
00:58:19,364 --> 00:58:22,564
my like really quickly i
870
00:58:22,564 --> 00:58:25,344
just already knows we do have to wrap it up soon here so i might go
871
00:58:25,344 --> 00:58:28,424
ahead and ask something then i'll do the wrap-up oh i was
872
00:58:28,424 --> 00:58:31,284
going to just say one of my favorite pieces that
873
00:58:31,284 --> 00:58:34,344
you did is actually surprised of me as the
874
00:58:34,344 --> 00:58:37,164
zombie what you did for my you're gonna say that a
875
00:58:37,164 --> 00:58:40,144
lot of fun yeah that was a lot i i
876
00:58:40,144 --> 00:58:42,924
really enjoyed doing i think was there more
877
00:58:42,924 --> 00:58:46,684
than one piece that was done for that there was yeah there was the front cover
878
00:58:46,684 --> 00:58:52,004
painting in the back with like an ink and and i did smash my head into one of
879
00:58:52,004 --> 00:58:56,524
your family photos wall when i was at your house that's a whole other story
880
00:58:56,524 --> 00:59:00,544
yeah we'll have to have dan back on again to talk about that.
881
00:59:01,204 --> 00:59:03,984
Yeah fun well before we wrap it
882
00:59:03,984 --> 00:59:06,824
up dan one of the things we do on our on our show at the
883
00:59:06,824 --> 00:59:09,804
end of each episode we always ask every artist or actor
884
00:59:09,804 --> 00:59:12,744
whoever we have on the show is what comic book
885
00:59:12,744 --> 00:59:16,164
that you would recommend to our audience this week so now
886
00:59:16,164 --> 00:59:19,304
you can't say your own obviously we want to but we can't say no i
887
00:59:19,304 --> 00:59:22,484
know i don't want i don't that's not fun so what
888
00:59:22,484 --> 00:59:25,384
would you recommend for this week oh man you know
889
00:59:25,384 --> 00:59:28,184
i haven't been to a comic shop in a while because the last time i went to
890
00:59:28,184 --> 00:59:31,244
one there were too many people walking around without masks
891
00:59:31,244 --> 00:59:39,484
on it was super annoying annoying they let them in well yeah that's why i don't
892
00:59:39,484 --> 00:59:42,844
go to that shop right now i'm not going there i'll wait till name this shop
893
00:59:42,844 --> 00:59:49,724
name that shop fuck them i'm kidding i'm kidding I mean, I...
894
00:59:50,827 --> 00:59:55,387
To be honest, I think, you know, I mean, when you're in your own store and they
895
00:59:55,387 --> 00:59:59,447
tell you that once you wear masks and people come into your shop and then decide
896
00:59:59,447 --> 01:00:02,107
to not wear them or take them off. Yeah.
897
01:00:02,587 --> 01:00:06,427
You can do what you can do, but then they're your customers and it's really hard.
898
01:00:06,547 --> 01:00:09,747
I mean, I walk into Walmart and see people with no mask, walk right in and no
899
01:00:09,747 --> 01:00:10,827
one even says anything. Yeah.
900
01:00:11,167 --> 01:00:15,127
Why don't they say something? Yeah. You know, sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.
901
01:00:15,167 --> 01:00:19,287
I mean, I, I, all I can do is just protect myself as much as I can.
902
01:00:19,287 --> 01:00:22,867
And so I, but as far, this is not answering your question. I was like,
903
01:00:22,927 --> 01:00:24,167
yeah, that's a whole other episode.
904
01:00:26,127 --> 01:00:29,687
Maybe there's a COVID comic out there. Any comic book, any comic book you want.
905
01:00:30,287 --> 01:00:33,007
Now you know what happens when you get me on your show. You have to have,
906
01:00:33,007 --> 01:00:36,627
you have to have more time. Don't blame me. You blame Mike. Next time we won't have this problem.
907
01:00:37,207 --> 01:00:39,627
I blame Mike. I blame only myself.
908
01:00:40,327 --> 01:00:44,527
As far as a comic book that I would recommend off the top of my head,
909
01:00:44,607 --> 01:00:50,707
I would recommend going back and find the trade paperback collections of of, ah, damn it.
910
01:00:52,487 --> 01:00:56,527
Oh, boy, oh, boy. Sorry, I'm just completely drawing a blank.
911
01:00:56,607 --> 01:00:57,847
No, you're okay. You're okay.
912
01:00:58,107 --> 01:01:03,047
Damn it. It's Tom Coker's book with, oh, you know what? I'll tell you what you should read.
913
01:01:03,467 --> 01:01:09,567
What's up? A great comic that I discovered when they hired me to do some covers
914
01:01:09,567 --> 01:01:12,167
for it, and I'd never heard of it before. It's called Mind Management.
915
01:01:12,647 --> 01:01:19,047
Okay. And it's this twisty, kind of psychological espionage thing that's just
916
01:01:19,047 --> 01:01:23,807
completely crazy by Matt Gint. He writes it. He does the art.
917
01:01:24,829 --> 01:01:32,209
It is very much not mainstream, but you can tell there's a love of so many different things in this work.
918
01:01:32,729 --> 01:01:35,689
They come from comics, but also films and other things like that.
919
01:01:35,889 --> 01:01:38,009
But Mind Management is really cool.
920
01:01:38,269 --> 01:01:40,849
I did the variant coverage for the second series.
921
01:01:41,469 --> 01:01:44,449
But go back and find, actually, it's not even the second series.
922
01:01:44,549 --> 01:01:48,489
I guess it's the newest series. I think there's three volumes of collected stuff now. Awesome, awesome.
923
01:01:48,749 --> 01:01:51,629
Three thick volumes of comics, and they're great. it's about
924
01:01:51,629 --> 01:01:55,849
this sort of secret history of people who kind of have psychic
925
01:01:55,849 --> 01:01:59,229
powers and but it's plays
926
01:01:59,229 --> 01:02:03,769
completely against what you might expect that to be i have a copy here's my
927
01:02:03,769 --> 01:02:08,949
copies right here this is what the trades look like they look like workbooks
928
01:02:08,949 --> 01:02:14,529
oh yeah that's pretty cool my man has a report three of three cognizance operatives
929
01:02:14,529 --> 01:02:18,689
and their invisible influence including important Important details regarding your past involvement.
930
01:02:18,969 --> 01:02:23,569
So it's about how events can happen in history and they can be erased from our mind.
931
01:02:24,089 --> 01:02:30,249
It's about how we, the secret society and groups that are planting ideas in
932
01:02:30,249 --> 01:02:31,529
our heads that we don't know about.
933
01:02:31,909 --> 01:02:35,569
It's fascinating. Wow. And I highly recommend it.
934
01:02:35,769 --> 01:02:40,869
That sounds like probably the best recommendation we've had so far on the show. So thank you.
935
01:02:41,409 --> 01:02:47,569
You're welcome. You're welcome. Also, Manor Black by Cullen Bunn and Tyler Crook is great.
936
01:02:47,849 --> 01:02:52,769
Yes, I did, you know, I did, I think, one or two covers for that.
937
01:02:52,889 --> 01:02:54,949
Maybe just, I think I've done two covers for that book.
938
01:02:55,149 --> 01:02:59,629
But I'm only saying because I did the covers, I read it. And I was like,
939
01:02:59,649 --> 01:03:01,289
this is cool. So this is good stuff too.
940
01:03:01,789 --> 01:03:07,129
Cullen is a friend of mine, but I love the stuff he does. He did Dark Ark is a really fun comic.
941
01:03:07,169 --> 01:03:10,469
If you like monsters and Noah's Ark stories.
942
01:03:11,609 --> 01:03:16,449
Awesome. And demons and vampires and, you know, manticores.
943
01:03:16,849 --> 01:03:21,809
So, yeah, that's kind of, that goes back like, you know, to last year.
944
01:03:22,509 --> 01:03:29,289
But I think there's plenty to be said for the trade paperback shelves at your local comic shop.
945
01:03:29,669 --> 01:03:33,609
Awesome. Mike, do you have anything last, any last words you want to say? Yeah.
946
01:03:34,524 --> 01:03:38,424
Well, I just want to say, Dan, thanks. I feel like we got to have you on again
947
01:03:38,424 --> 01:03:40,644
at some point so we can talk some
948
01:03:40,644 --> 01:03:43,644
more because I feel like there's so much more I want to cover with you.
949
01:03:43,884 --> 01:03:46,724
There's definitely going to be a part two. More of your processing.
950
01:03:47,444 --> 01:03:51,084
Yeah. If we can do a part two in November, that'd be great if you're down for that.
951
01:03:51,244 --> 01:03:54,704
Yeah, sure. Maybe after the X-Men book comes out, after Marvel number two comes.
952
01:03:54,784 --> 01:03:59,024
I call it the X-Men book, but it's not an X-Men book. It's an anthology.
953
01:03:59,184 --> 01:04:04,164
For sure. I share an issue with Alex Ross, Paolo Rivera.
954
01:04:04,524 --> 01:04:08,684
And Eric Powell, which means I am definitely a low man in the total poll,
955
01:04:08,884 --> 01:04:10,264
but I'm still looking forward to seeing.
956
01:04:10,924 --> 01:04:13,684
So hey, you're the high man in the total poll.
957
01:04:14,284 --> 01:04:17,504
Well, you don't have to say that. It's totally fine. No, it's true.
958
01:04:17,824 --> 01:04:21,264
Like I said, I am okay with all that. That's good.
959
01:04:21,464 --> 01:04:24,304
That's good. I'm okay with all that. You're an all human, Dan.
960
01:04:24,504 --> 01:04:26,284
I love it. I'm trying to be.
961
01:04:26,524 --> 01:04:28,524
We will continue this in November.
962
01:04:29,524 --> 01:04:32,104
Thank you so much, Dan. We really appreciate you being here.
963
01:04:32,104 --> 01:04:33,144
Thank you for the recommendation.
964
01:04:33,444 --> 01:04:37,824
And to everybody listening, thank you guys for listening. And this is- Thank you guys.
965
01:04:38,104 --> 01:04:40,864
Yeah, this is the original format. This is how we started the show.
966
01:04:40,924 --> 01:04:44,304
And we haven't done it like this in a long time. This is Mike's first time actually
967
01:04:44,304 --> 01:04:46,024
co-hosting. So thank you.
968
01:04:46,444 --> 01:04:50,404
And I cannot wait for this to continue to grow with Mike. So again,
969
01:04:50,504 --> 01:04:54,004
thank you so much, Dan. Thank you so much, Mike. Thank you to everyone listening.
970
01:04:54,464 --> 01:04:58,704
Before I do say one last thing, Dan, do you want to give your Instagram or anything
971
01:04:58,704 --> 01:05:02,244
like that right now? Yeah, it's Dan Brereton Illustrator on Instagram.
972
01:05:02,424 --> 01:05:07,704
And I have a lot of Facebook pages, public pages, Dan Brereton Nocturnals, Dan Brereton.
973
01:05:07,764 --> 01:05:11,964
So you can just throw a rock and you'll hit a Dan Brereton page on Facebook.
974
01:05:12,144 --> 01:05:16,144
That sounds amazing. Twitter and check out, check out the children and I kickstarter.
975
01:05:16,624 --> 01:05:19,844
If you guys are interested, if anyone's interested in finding any of my books,
976
01:05:19,944 --> 01:05:22,424
most of what I have, it's, it's available.
977
01:05:22,564 --> 01:05:24,644
It's on budsartbooks.com.
978
01:05:25,124 --> 01:05:30,684
They have really great prices on nocturnal books. And I, that's just the plain
979
01:05:30,684 --> 01:05:37,464
facts and anything you can't find there, you can try bigwowart.com and see what you can
980
01:05:37,564 --> 01:05:43,564
find that sounds thanks for having me absolutely uh mike thank you uh dan thank
981
01:05:43,564 --> 01:05:47,004
you everybody love each other take care of each other and we'll see you next week.
